Discussion Groups

its interesting and we need to keep our eyes on it: thanks lennard for thinking about this. i think you are right peter that the inudstry out there will need to see some iterations before it bets real money on it in mainstream applications. I'm not thinking of assigning any effort or money in the short to medium term; but one of the reasons for this community is to speed up exchange of insights ideas and information, internally and externally. When android is ready we will need to be and it looks like you are first in the queue peter. So we should keep our antennae in good working order. Anyone got any customers with a view on this?

We have had a few requests for Linux on our devices in the past. Interesting thought: customers able to choose their OS on our devices. It has been a success offering the choice between CE, Mobile Classic and Mobile Pro. It might be something compelling for future customers.

On the other hand, there is the matter of support to consider.

We have had a couple of partners inquire to PTX' roadmap for offering Android on our devices.

While there will always be a market out there for the anti-Microsoft, I think it is too early to tell how much of a benefit this would be for us to offer.  However, we should definitely keep an eye on in the near future and see how much of a market there really is.

I would love to present a project plan of putting Android on our device, but as John mentioned I do not think the information I have collected so far justifies starting a project at this moment.

We can however indirectly benefit from the OS war brought in by iPhone and Android.   Many new features have been added to latest WCE and WM OS including support for finger touch and gesture support, improved browser and their own App Store.

Offering WCE and WM with the new features may benefit our customers and ourselves the most as it would allow us to continue to provide support for legacy application and blend in the new features seemlessly.

For the non techies, what benefits would you say  android would bring over the other OSs?

I'd be concerned that as with all of Google's products and services, they're all about gathering information for Google to monetize. Do you really want to feed more data to them?

We're already getting requests for Android on the WAP and the Ikon to begin with. One of our current competitors which offers Android already is Trimble.

In any case, the availability of Android would give us a few noticeable advantages, including, but nor limited to: Java development, an open source community for application development which would allow more agile applications to be developed for our device(s), more flexibility, etc.

For those who are interested in learning more about the 'droid vs the rest of OSs out there, here are a few interesting links where Android is compared against WM 6.5, iPhone OS and other consumer based OS platforms:

eideard.wordpress.com/.../android-1-6-vs-windows-mobile-6-5-guess-who-wins

www.pcworld.idg.com.au/.../smartphone_os_showdown_android_vs_iphone_os_windows_mobile_vs_blackberry_os_more

www.mobilitysite.com/.../iphone-vs-android-vs-winmo-vs-webos-vs-blackberry-fight

www.itpro.co.uk/.../android-cupcake-vs-windows-mobile-6-5-vs-iphone-3-0-preview

It being an open source you are free to dig in http://android.git.kernel.org/ and see if there is a code feeding Google with some data ;)

1.)  Customization:  Android is open source, giving us the ability to customize pretty much anything we please (think Linux):   From how the screen/shell looks to being able to optimize the kernel to increase performance of particular modules important to our market (something we have limited abilities with Windows CE/Mobile).  So many bad situations in the past could have been avoided (as well as new opportunities) if we had full control over the entire operating system.

2.)  Google-appeal:  From what I understand, Android's app store already has more applications than Blackberry (more appealing ones, based on certain reviews).  Think of apps like Google Docs/Maps, and how popular they are with users.  If Google can create the legion of app developers that iPhone has created, then we would be missing out on a sizeable market by not giving it due attention.

@Steven Cox: 100% agreed!

1. If you want to browse Android market go here http://www.cyrket.com/.

2. Android develper community already is huge and growin. Thanks to open source!

3. Although those are closed source apps, can you imagine what you could build on top of Google Maps? Think Mobile market.

4. For our partners it is an easy decision between $400 for VS.NET vs. free Eclipse with ADT.

Steven Cox

 Customization:  Android is open source, giving us the ability to customize pretty much anything we please (think Linux):   From how the screen/shell looks to being able to optimize the kernel to increase performance of particular modules important to our market (something we have limited abilities with Windows CE/Mobile).  So many bad situations in the past could have been avoided (as well as new opportunities) if we had full control over the entire operating system.

Hi Steve,

Completely right. With open source we do not depend on anybody and we don't have to pray for a solution to a problem we can't solve by ourselves. We are facing a problem, we can correct it. (OK that's not so simple, but open sources are much more flexible than the bricks offered by Microsoft to build Window CE/Mobile)
Moreover, if I'm not wrong, it is possible to protect our code by the Apache licence and all the sources are not obliged to be free, from our side. (Don’t bite me, I'm really pro open sources !!!!)

Steven Cox

Google-appeal:  From what I understand, Android's app store already has more applications than Blackberry (more appealing ones, based on certain reviews).  Think of apps like Google Docs/Maps, and how popular they are with users.  If Google can create the legion of app developers that iPhone has created, then we would be missing out on a sizeable market by not giving it due attention.

On this part of your answer, I must confess that I don't think so... in any case, the first thing that customers request is to lock down the terminal, specifically to avoid users to add custom apps. In the field the terminal is a tool exactly as a screwdriver and must not be considered as toy by user... But effectively, if Google becomes a major actor of this market, that means users will know it and will be sensible to find a known environment on the tool they use daily...

But to be completely clear, I'm not really sure that Android is really requested by our customers. Of course they are looking for news on this direction but our market, as said previously, is moving slower than the technologies arrive. I think that functionalities like multitouch or gesture are completely useless in the field. In the end, the important thing is the business specific application running on the terminal and not the environment running on the terminal itself... programming this app in C#, C++, Java or something else isn't important... the only important things are the ergonomic of the terminal and the ergonomic of the application...

For example In SCL most of our clients continue to use Telnet emulation (or at least characters app) because no other techno has never proved it could be more productive... and even in WAM, most of the time the touch screen is used but the developers continue to add keyboard shortcuts to the main functionalities, because no touch screen or other techno is able to be more productive than a series of keyboard shortcuts... (have you ever seen a Starcraft player using something else than keyboard shortcut for example ?)

Cheers,

Rastislav Hodul

Although those are closed source apps, can you imagine what you could build on top of Google Maps? Think Mobile market

Hi Ratislav, Google Maps, is precisely one of the applications that Google is using to make a lot of money, do you really think they have invest so much money to have a map of the entire planet and to give it for free without another business model behin?
The problem is that app are closed source and we don't know how Google uses the colected data...
Imagine a world where google will be aware of any of your moves, do you really want to live in this world?
And do you really think a entreprise really wants to use such tools?

As long as I don't know what Google makes with my privacy I prefer avoiding such applications, just in case...

Rastislav Hodul

For our partners it is an easy decision between $400 for VS.NET vs. free Eclipse with ADT.

I don't agree... 400 $ is really a small investment compared to the hundred hours needed to developp the applications, testing, debugging it and so on...

Cheers

David Brugneaux

For example In SCL most of our clients continue to use Telnet emulation (or at least characters app) because no other techno has never proved it could be more productive... and even in WAM, most of the time the touch screen is used but the developers continue to add keyboard shortcuts to the main functionalities, because no touch screen or other techno is able to be more productive than a series of keyboard shortcuts... (have you ever seen a Starcraft player using something else than keyboard shortcut for example ?)

Cheers,

Well, there are definitely some interesting touch and motion control stuff coming down the pipes. To build on your example, I imagine a starcraft player using something like microsoft's surface over keyboards in the future. But in terms of the mobile space, things like motion detection cellphones seem pretty amazing. As well as the ability to read brainwaves directly

And I, for one, welcome our google overlords.

Greg Smyth

Well, there are definitely some interesting touch and motion control stuff coming down the pipes. To build on your example, I imagine a starcraft player using something like microsoft's surface over keyboards in the future. But in terms of the mobile space, things like motion detection cellphones seem pretty amazing. As well as the ability to read brainwaves directly

Definitively right Greg!!!
I can imagine a lot of applications in the "real" life... video games, home automation, car audio or video systems, health and medical industry and so on that can found an interest of those new features... but... I must confess I can't imagine any of this technologies having an application in our business... maybe it's because for now, the only applications I've seen using motion detection and gesture were the IPhone games...

Cheers.